Game Jam XI: Postmortem

[SStrickland]

Your thoughts concerning Game Jam XI.

What improvements can be made?

[R_matey]

+Overall I think this Game Jam went over very well.
+ want to thank Steve, again for sacrificing this game jam for everybody. He did a very good job (food, what a nice guy)
+Thanks to Runkle for being our real team leader and keeping everybody on track.
+Thanks to Aaron, Jen, and Graham for coming out to Game Jam for the first time and being on my team.
+Thanks to anyone who made Game Jam a good time Stewart, Josh, Aldo, Vern, Jesse photos ,  and pretty much everyone who competed.

-Just some side notes
-Finding a way to push unreal more. (possible extra point or more emphasis on final presentations and the use of unreal)
-We say this every quarter but making sure we hit our sunday 5pm end point (not so bad this quarter but it is always a note)
-Bringing Back the prototype winners - If we get more VGP or Devry students- We should have a side competition to see who makes the most complete game-just something to drive them.

Other than that, I should be defending my belt next quarter if I am still in the area. I want a grudge match so lets make it fun.

[TeacupBandit]

This Game jam was awesome! Hopefully you, Matey, as well as Vern, will still be around for next quarter. I have to second on a few comments:

-I really enjoyed using Unreal and implementing it further would be great.
-Thanks to Steve who would not budge slightly on his deadlines, so next quarter we can start presenting at least a half hour earlier if we stick to his moderating techniques.

I too wanna thank my team for all of their efforts and hard work. It was awesome and I cant wait for next quarter.
-Also thanks to Aldo, Runkle, and Orion who stuck around this quarter and participated again and shared their knowledge, as well as a few laughs.
-I personally wanna thank Vern and Orion for helping me tons with Unreal.

[jackelbeaver]

Awesome Game Jam overall.  Everyone did great jobs and there were many penises to be had by all.


Also a little idea for the next game jam, give a point for rigging a model and some points for doing simple, sweet animation.  Not only would it help us get a better understanding of making sure how to make our models friendly for animation purposes, but we might get some animation students in as well.  It'd also be a nice way to really push people all the way towards the end of the jam.

[Butterguts]

Yeah it was a pretty sweet game jam overall, from my point of view as well. A win would have been sweet, but it's whatever, I keep saying it's a learning experience first and a competition second, and if I say it a few more times, maybe I'll start to believe it.

I'll reiterate the obvious first:
Steve you did AMAZING, everything went perfectly, and the budget seemed to be more than enough, which is even better news. Happy that worked out.
I really like the Unreal Challenge or whatever it turns into. I like Unreal alot, and I know it takes away from the programmers and what they are here for, so we need to remember them first, but I think it's an awesome rule... mainly cause I made it.
You are incorrect Mr. Ohlberg, their were in fact to few penises, next Jam needs at least twice as many.
I really enjoyed the Unreal questions from the "Breasticles" you asking me questions makes me learn the things I once knew. So it's awesome, anytime hit me up, I'd be more than happy to help.

To the one's I love... and hate(that's you aldo):
My team was pretty sweet this Jam, even though I didn't know where half of them were most of Jam.
To Aldo, for making a model Saturday night and forcing me to show a chamfered box and a robot leg at our check points.
To Jeff, for modeling a bunch of nothing, but then turning my planes of "the tunnel" into some Fonzie points.
To Caleb, for putting up with a rather shitty team. Just to let you know, most teams are usually more structured and organized that we were. I hope you learned something, or at least feel like you didn't waste your time.
To Tonto, for some good ass chicken... and some ham egg plant stuff, that gooed all over me, but in the good way.
And last but not least, to me, for being that awesome, carried the entire team on my broad rippling shoulders.
You Jesse, for not showing up, except for that sweet ass roller blading video, dude... you got some sweet moves. 

Some things to Nit-Pick, cause I can:
The Folder Structure was horrible, just saying. I had to navigate 40 folders to just in something for any given checkpoint.
I still think the overall schedule needs some work, smoothing out checkpoints and timing of things would be awesome.
I think that's it, if i think of anything else, i'll modify this or re-post them.

Questions to other people.
What is the opinion on adding additional points Unreal and rigging and such?
Any rules or things that you would add personaly, let em' fly, this is the place to be heard. Anything you didn't like/really liked?

P.S. This will be my last Game Jam that I will compete in. I graduate this quarter and plan on returning to Texas, so unless something interesting happens... It's been grand, and I loved every moment.

[Kraemology]

First and foremost, much love to everyone who came out, participated, and made game jam what it is today. This was my 6th and by far the most stress free jam I've had. Everyone on our team busted their ass and was there working whenever possible. Every one of us, even our noob Steven who wasn't there half the time, practiced and learned a lot in some form or fashion. I personally feel our efforts as a team could have been more efficient and streamlined, but let that be a lesson for next jam.

Not sure what to think about unreal vs many potential prototypers from AIPX/Devry. At the moment, the Unreal idea is very awesome and I look forward to tackling that my next jam. If however, we start to see more and more prototypers from Devry then I'd lean more towards virtools and getting a solid prototype up and running.

As far as improving game jam, I think we should make it more like a game and give teams interesting ways to win. Examples would be...

Points for additional characters, props, environments
Points for animation and rigging
Points for game design, gameplay, and innovation
Additional fonzie points

So for example, a team could win by simply doing the most models/textures, doing the best models/textures, doing some awesome animation, having awesome gameplay/mechanics, or a mix of all of the above. Obviously the idea would require some tweaking, but atleast it would let both individuals and teams focus on any particular area of gaming that interests them. This includes the prototypers since any game design and/or gameplay would obviously focus more heavily on their skills and the playtests of the team itself.

Also, getting more instructor/industry critique would be a huge + 

[reneejo]

Yes, I agree with jared, pretty much on every point. With more possibilties to earn points, the out come for a winner may be WAY more unpredictable. Also gives us incentive to really utilize our strengths and bring out more of a competitive spirit.

[SStrickland]

Does anybody know who on BC didn't get a belt?

[reneejo]

I'm pretty sure graham didn't get his.

[reneejo]

you know what strickland, I sorta forgot that I still have my belt from before because...well, I kept forgetting to bring it back. I could just give it to graham next time I see him. besides we have a few classes together. Sorry....

[TeacupBandit]

One thing I thought about was the budget. Dont get me wrong, prizes are cool and all, but thats not the reason I participate. If we are gonna give games as prizes, I think they should be donated by participants. An idea I had was to utilize the budget for other things, such as maybe getting different color Tshirts and items to decorate them with as well. It gives teams more of an opportunity for the Team Spirit points. Make that A little competitive as well. Its also fun. The only reason I suggest this is because I know that no one on my team had the funds to something like this, plus the hours of game jam make it kinda difficult to go to the store. Best of all, it would be a lot cheaper than games and we could recycle the items not used. it also would allow the team members to leave with more souvenir from there experience. Just a thought, what do you all think?

[jackelbeaver]

We should get Game Jam t-shirts as prizes

[SStrickland]

Sad to think this is your last Vern. At least you went out with some bangin' concept art.

I found it hilarious how many folders were labeled "enviroment".

I understand what you are trying to say Jarrod. Those new point changes may be really hard to balance in. For instance, is doing more models worth more than doing good models? If it is, how much more is it worth? I'm not saying we shouldn't do it, I just think we need a long, serious discussion to balance it correctly.

The points for teams are so varied. Without looking, i think the difference between 1st and last was something like 20 points. The biggest thing in Game Jam is getting your work into the correct place at the correct time. If every team would have done that, this would have been a way tighter Jam. BC was the only team that turned everything in on time. The only point they lost was for the first day, not having all 5 members present.

their were in fact to few penises, next Jam needs at least twice as many.

Not when outsiders show up.

Sorry to put the hammer down on some teams, but hopefully this will help participants take schedules and checkpoints more seriously not just in Game Jam, but professionally as well.

I already changed in the schedule the last checkpoint time. Starting at three will hopefully allow the Mod more time for judging. I also highlighted items that need to be placed in a folder at time of checkpoint.

(... more emphasis on final presentations and the use of unreal)

Unreal did push Breasticles presentation higher. It was really cool to see their assets in game so to speak.

Thanks to Nate, Justin, Onion, Max, Stu, Dico, RC, and anyone else that helped me judge Fonzie points. They helped change my mind on more than one point.

Speaking on that last note, I want to ask everybody this. What makes for an environment Fonzie point? A more fully realized and represented environment, or a more complex mesh and texture sheet? This is something we need to nail down.

No problem Renee. You can give it to Graham, or you can put it on my desk down in Student Affairs. It would be really cool to get it back.

Josh, Kraemer has been saying something like this as well. We need to bring it up on the Officer Meeting. Games are actually about the cheapest thing you can buy surprisingly enough. If you go to a Gamestop, they have a buy 2 get one free XBox rack. If you are buying 99c games, you are only paying 2 bucks for prizes for 3 people. We got away with 25 games for only 30 bucks I think. But like I said, lets bring it up at the meeting.

If anybody has any ideas for different food than pizza, let your thoughts be heard.

[R_matey]

Jarred I know you have been talking about this for awhile. Most of what you have said is already established. There are side quest points for most of the points. Additional models can be a higher poly models projected for normal maps. Fonzie points are already given out for best models / textures. The more quantity of objects point- I can make 12 crates in one day or make 1 good character model. Should I get 12 points for the crate? The way Game Jam is now is very balanced , where there is enough work for the veterans to focus on and not too much for noobs to be daunted. I have come to realize this after thinking of how a 7 player team would work. It doesn't, the way the numbers are now is vanilla and anything extra is a cherry on top.

If you want to make some changes, please think out your ideas and have a more direct proposal.   

[JustinM]

Sad to think this is your last Vern. At least you went out with some bangin' concept art.

Agreed. On both.

I already changed in the schedule the last checkpoint time. Starting at three will hopefully allow the Mod more time for judging.

Sweet, that's cool to hear. I was going to suggest that same thing (pushing the final checkpoint up earlier to 3 or 3:30) because having to rush through final presentations, prototypes, and judging while getting kicked out of the building before the winners are announced and Game Jam is officially over just really sucks and kinda kills the vibe.

their were in fact to few penises, next Jam needs at least twice as many.

I know you're probably joking, but we/the SGDA should seriously try to maintain a certain level of professionalism throughout Game Jam. Jarrod suggested getting more instructor/industry people to critique, and I agree that'd be awesome, but do we really want instructors/industry people to see a penis on every other slide during a presentation? Presentations should still be fun/humorous, but they should mainly be focused around the game concept and the art that's been created. There needs to be a balance between professionalism and over-the-top vandalism/humor to where if an industry professional was to come in and judge, they wouldn't leave thinking that the SGDA is just a joke.



[quote from Matey from the locked Schedule and Point thread] "Vandals should not be mandatory in a presentation, it is left on the presenters decision. I think a lot of presentations lacked direction because of this, and at the end of their presentation I had no idea what their final game was."

I completely agree. The only presentation where I felt like I really got a sense of what the game was about was after your (Matey) presentation. You did a great job of going through and explaining everything while showing off your teams art and still made the entire thing very entertaining. It's unfortunate that I can't say the same for the other presentations. Aldo made a sweet robot character that he only showed for about 2 seconds during his presentation yet afterwards when judging (actually getting a chance to look at it) he ended up getting the Fonzie point for that character so it's a shame he didn't show it off properly to everyone. Whatever. That's just my 2 cents.

[Aldo]

I always feel like I have to defend my team after Game Jam. so here goes:

Main point #1: When I started doing Game Jam...7 or 8 Game Jams ago? It was a pretty serious and straight forward affair. Sometimes the 'vets' at the time would make fun of each other but mostly everyone stuck to themselves and it seemed a lot more serious. There was also a high fear of 'No, I'm not good enough to do Game Jam"...I we started at 6th quarter and it felt 'early'...so once we became officers, we tried to get rid of that fear and open game jam to lots of people...now a lot of 1st and 2nd quarter people are doing it but I still think there is that fear of 'I'm not ready yet'....so I try to lighten the mood and just make people more friendly. Do I think people should copy our team in our ridiculousness? no, not at all, but I dont' think it's a 'problem'. (If anything...maybe take away the point for doing vandalizations)

If you look at the last two game jams..the 'serious' team was always the ones who won...which is how it should be.

Main Point #2: Vern was our team leader, so blame him for everything, especially the presentation.



Now for my critiques of the actual Game Jam.

I think the meeting before Game Jam should be structured better and tell people what is expected and how things should be...no, not naming conventions or that it's 30 hours of Pam (who didn't show....and I was totally disappointed), personally, here's how I would structure Jam.

Thursday: Game Jam meeting. Rules are gone over, the same stuff we've been doing. Also point out things like...the teams who are most efficient and turn stuff in on time is probably going to win. Make a point of saying that's it's about learning and they SHOULD ask the vets to help them and teach them stuff because during Jam is the best time for that. Introduce some people and have them give 'tips' for having a successful Jam.

Also, Game play mechanics are handed out along with the verbs and everything else, so people can come up with an idea if they wanted and maybe start doing some concepts or whatever they wanted. (if they want to be hardcore and stay up the day before Jam and work on stuff then they should be able to). I think the 'twist' and verbs are kinda pointless because most people ignore them or try to figure out a way to incorporate them without changing their core idea that they had to begin with...for example: Ok, so we're going to make a game about a boy hitting enemies with a hammer. Our twist and verbs are "kick, tuna, shooting"....ok, so our boy kicks ass, with his hammer he calls tuna...while trying to save shooting stars? See what I mean? So, just hand out all the info for Jam and don't worry about it.

Friday:

After thinking of ideas the night before, you should come in friday and decide which one you're going to do or who's going to do what...and then start concepting. I think the idea should be that by 5 pm on Friday, you should present your game as an idea....talk about the story, mechanics and show concept art...You can show black and white if you want, but I honestly get bored at looking at the black and white concept then 30 seconds later, looking at the colored ones...just show the finished ones and move on. I think there should be critiques at this point about drawing style and maybe tips on how to make things better or color in photoshop. Maybe even some gameplay critiques if the idea is going to be prototyped. Nothing else but these things should be shown...no beginning models or anything like that...just pitch the idea like you're pitching it to a company.

The rest of the night should be spent starting to model. and just working on stuff.

Saturday:

Most of the day is really a work day. At 5 P.M. You show your completed models w/ optional Uvw's and nothing else. No early or completed textures. I think for fonzie points, it's hard to judge between a good model and a model that is already textured. It's not fair...model should be judged against model. Also, it helps set a standard of what is expected. At the meeting, there should also be a set point for critiques and giving advice on maybe how to model something easier or more efficient. The rest of the day will be finishing up textures and stuff.

Sunday:

The beginning of the day should be about finishing up your textures and then creating renders for the presentations.

Final Presentation: It should be a recap of your concept and concept drawings and then your final assets. Leave out all the random sketches you made of stuff you didn't model or other concepts that you did in like 2 mins. To me, those slow down the presentations. Also  leave out 'in progress' shots and other 'boring' things. These should have been shown at other points and critiqued then. I think most of the 'funny' stuff should be left out. No Lol cats, no look at this person's head on this fat person's body..if you're going to do something like that...show it at the end or post it online? Or maybe make one giant folder for vandalizations and just go through it while we're waiting for the judging or tallying points.


Personally, I feel like there should be two 'winners'...the best prototype winner and the best art team winner. The Art team would be like how we choose the current winners but the best prototype winners should be judged by how cool their final stuff came together...meaning....if you wanted to work on a bunch of stuff to make a better prototype...you can and even though your art wouldn't be as good because you can't focus on one for long....you would create a lot of good parts that would create an 'awesome' whole. I' think this would be benefit for the earlier teams because maybe they can't make the best art, but if they make enough and make it look good in an engine, then they would have a chance at winning too. For example...Breasticles...their stuff looked good in engine and I don't think they got enough credit for that. Also, if you look at runkle's props and environment, they were super simple, but together, when put in the environment with everything else, it made a really cool cohesive 'whole' and was a pretty unique way to build an environment...sure they won, but I think it's different to do something like than, than to just build one cool hallway. Also, I think people would approach game jam in different ways and probably wouldn't ever really feel cheated but the judging (for fonzie points or at the end?) wouldn't come down to deciding between "complex 'next gen' asset" VS "many cool but not as complex assets." Vet teams can concentrate on the one amazing asset, while the newer teams can concentrate on making a cooler prototype.

I think this also kinda helps with the feeling of 'having to do a prototype sucks'. I know there are a few people who realize that having to put your stuff in engine is a lot harder because you have to worry about naming conventions, spend time working on gameplay ideas, spend time converting textures, keeping thing in realistic limits, etc (which you get no points for)....it's just easier to skip prototyping and focus on just modeling and texturing (which you get points for). So, with two winners, you can have people who really care about making a cool prototype winning, and having the teams who just want to make cool assets also winning. (instead of just the 'asset' team winning).

I dunno...that's about it for now..tired of typing.

Sorry to Justin if he feels I make the SGDA seem like a joke or not professional.

[Butterguts]

Quote from Jared on the Schedule and Points thread

Agreed, but why have vandals no one is going to see but that will ultimately be judged?

Exactly, take them away again. I've seen you art the previous two days, the final presentation should be a spectacle, an event to say the least. It should have laughs. By day one I knew what everybody's game concept was, by day two, I've seen your art. Day 3 and the final presentation is about what you team is, how you team handled game jam, and the "characters" on that team. If the fun isn't there, then what the hell are we doing at jam besides wasting time. I go to Jam for laughs, to help other students, and get to know people I normally wouldn't. I get to know you by your presentations. See who the people behind the art is.

I know you're probably joking

And it was a joke.

I understand that it's "not professional" and wouldn't be approved by industry professionals or whatever. But I disagree completely. If that we're the case then why are the "phallic" objects in from major Disney  movies, they find it humorous to. At the end of the day, we are all adults, but it's still to funny to see a penises wearing a Civil War hat. And I'm pretty sure if i was 65 years old and saw a dick wearing a army helmet, I'd still giggle.

And a quick question, when has their ever been a professional from the industry coming to critique at the final presentation of game jam. It doesn't happen. If you can pull that off, do it, and then clean up the act and make it more professional. I wish we could have people from rainbow or 2XL come and look at our stuff, really critique it, but that's very unlikely to happen. Why hamper what makes game jam fun, for the sake of teaching someone that they should not put a giant dick in the portfolio? Most should already know better. If game jam was any less fun that it currently is, I honestly couldn't say I would do it as often. There's no other payoff.

I think we should make it more like a game and give teams interesting ways to win.

disagree. I think game jam should be about the art honestly. I know i enjoy the fun, previously mentioned, but creating or learning to create good art is what jam is all about. 12 crates doesn't equal 1 extremely well done character. Matey is absolutely correct. I like the point system, I like the set up. I don't like the 5 oclock check point on day 2 cause its' boring, but it's a necessity, i guess. If I could win other ways with volume, I would come to jam, create a bunch of trash, rig it horribly and walk away with an insane amount of points for learning or improving absolutely none. That's like saying, we will give a team points for feeding the judges delicious food. We didn't expect, nor did we ever ask for them. And it did hurt our team, that was one member we didn't have.... but that chicken was amazing. The points systems is nearly flawless in my opinion.

Plus, how difficult is it to run jam right now anyway. Let alone if the structure was broader. What if their were 8 folders to check rather than 1, and some had different focuses. Seems a little ridiculous. Plus none of us should really be focused on Animation anyway, except for that sweet heart Stu . We should be about the art, the good art and that's it.

P.S. Aldo posted while I was typing so if anythings redundant... my fault.

[TeacupBandit]

I do agree with many of the points presented by Vern and Aldo. Unfortunately there are way to many to point out.

As of right now, I do also think that the verbs and twist are getting pointless, BUT i think we should keep them. I think we need to implement a rule that says, "Your verbs MUST be present as verbs in your game." If the verb is kick, That boy had better be kicking or points get docked.

Also, Art twists... A boxing kangaroo is not an art twist. It is an object. Wartime, that is an art twist. I think that we should look over those and take out some ones that are clearly not a twist, and maybe even add some new ones. I think that this also needs to be clearly shown.

The reason I point this out is because when a project is handed to you in the industry, you do what it says. "Oh its about a cricket, so i think I'll make a cockroach." Thats not gonna fly in the industry.

It is really hard to draw that line between appropriate and unprofessional since we are students. We want to have fun and give a good presentation, but we are all also serious about what we've done. I think the big issue is the fact that someone came in on the vandals (which were funny). From what I have heard from Tav, but not confirmed anywhere else, is that the guy was the President of Devry takin a look at what we did. He happened to have his son with him also. Apparently he was cool about it and thought it was funny. Even if this isn't true, who knows who will walk in next time. So it is kind of a hard decision to make, but I dont think that that should be the focus. It is a good laugh after a long three days.

The more quantity of objects point- I can make 12 crates in one day or make 1 good character model. Should I get 12 points for the crate?

I agree and disagree with this. I think that this could get really bad really fast. tons of just random crap doesnt make a game, but rarely does a character and 3 props. Most of the time, a lot of teams make extra items, i know both times, my teams have. I think that that should be recognized somehow.

I think that there is just a huge transition happening right now from how vet officers want to run game jam and how newer officers want to. We just need to find a happy medium and still keep this all fun and a great learning experience.

[Aldo]

I think that there is just a huge transition happening right now from how vet officers want to run game jam and how newer officers want to.

That is what is happening...and I'll try to say this in a way that won't offend people (but I'll probably fail).

I don't think the vets matter at all. I think you guys (the newer officers) should do what you want to do because you're in charge now. I know I go to Game Jam to pretty much hang out and see what you guys come up with...not really to compete...so all these rules and stuff that you guys throw out or come up with or even concerns about game jam....I really don't care because I probably won't be following them even if I participated because I'm not really concerned about winning. So it's the earlier quarter students that you guys should be dealing with and trying to get them to participate and become part of the process of making Game Jam better.

[JustinM]

Aldo, you don't have to defend yourself/your team, but if my comment/s inspired you to post that crazy-long post then I'm quite glad because everything you mentioned in that crazy-long post is excellent and I totally agree with. You made a lot of really good points that I think should be addressed/considered. To pick stuff out I'd have to say I especially agree with the judging models against models, and not against textured models. That is unfair and people shouldn't be allowed to turn in textured models at that checkpoint. I also really like the idea of having a separate winner for best prototype because like you said teams should be rewarded for doing all the extra work that's involved with getting assets and textures in game, but as Game Jam is now, they aren't.

Vern. Touche about the Disney films. I agree that Game Jam should be fun and people should be laughing, joking around, and having a good time. I mean, why go to Game Jam if it isn't fun, right? Game Jam is about learning, but it's not all about learning and I don't think it should be. If Game Jam was 100% about learning people would be better off just staying home and doing tutorials all weekend. I guess it'd just be nice to see "fun" in a different form other than a penis. Luckily that guy who walked in was cool with it (apparently), but content should never be at the point where it might offend someone if the wrong person walks in.

[Aldo]

Luckily that guy who walked in was cool with it (apparently)

Just to put all the speculation to rest..he was cool with it...I heard him say it to Dico. He used to be the dean of the school..now I think he's the dean of Devry....he really enjoyed our presentations.

[TeacupBandit]

Just to put all the speculation to rest..he was cool with it...I heard him say it to Dico. He used to be the dean of the school..now I think he's the dean of Devry....he really enjoyed our presentations.

Well this is good, but it may not always be the case. We just need to be cautious of that, but at the same time it is not my right to say what one can draw and cannot draw. Just as no one can do the same to me.

[Butterguts]

That's cool that he wasn't offended.

And all this is a catch 22, and I'll pull my say out. Aldo is right, it's not in our hands anymore. Us vets are out and really our opinions shouldn't matter as much as the current/remaining officers and students, if at all. But the catch 22 I speak of is, if we get busted for "inappropriate" material the SGDA and Game Jam will suffer due to faculty, but if Game Jam is boring and no fun, then we will suffer from lack of student body support.

I've always taken pride in the fact that the SGDA is one of the best, if not the best organization in school and the fact that we do have a community and a long running event in Game Jam. I'd hate to jeopardize that in any way.

[R_matey]

I think we are leaving it in good hands and it is one thing to pass on the ball compared to dropping the ball.I know looking back at pass shifts, i didn't even know if there was going to be a Game Jam 6 or 7. I know our group had to take it from barely 3 teams; to 7 teams of 5. Running Game Jam is work and if I had any insight and help goes a far way. I still wish some past officers and others would show some love like Ben, Pat , Swink, and others that were apart of making past game happen.  It is also encouraging to see AI alumni who still give their attention to the Jam, like Jamus, Ron , Runkle, Jose, Aldo and others.

Any who there isn't a reason why past experience should be forgotten. Talking about how the verbs and art twist should mean something now , is ridiculous for a reason. Having strict guidelines suck , and stunt motivation and creativity. In the past you were stuck to a fable that you had to make into a game. The game design suffered, composition suffered, and personally 1 whole day went down the shittier because of it. Sometimes there is a reason
So one persons hands off is anothers neglect sometimes, There is still remnants of that, SGDA payed membership? Business Cards ? Jobquest? Mascot Contest? and other such things. Help and guidance is usually not a bad thing.

[duoxan]

no no no
the verbs and stuff were initiated to set you on a spring board of sorts
you could take them and run, or leave them behind you and go with another totally different thing
we ARENT the industry, nor are we IN the industry, so let me have some fun and be creative NOW, before i get a boss telling me what i can and cant do
granted, i wasnt there, so i can really say anything, but if some dude DID walk in, and he was offended by some penis art
i would politely ask him to leave
i dont think people should have to walk on egg shells around others all the time
i EXPECT penises(peni?) from vern and matey
the reason the points are set up this way, is it keeps you focused, instead of worrying about making 20 assets, we shouldnt be worried if a game is made with 20 or 2 assets, we arent making a game here
the prototypers always had a contest, and one of them SHOULD get something, but we stopped because we had like three the last jams
and i love the prototypers and what they do but jam is about one thing
ART
thats why game jam was started, and its evolved to include other degrees which is cool, and to inspire other degrees to do the same
its not a competition, its not about the prototypes, its about making art, good art, that matches, and learning to work in a team with others (which ill admit, im glad matey, vern, runkle, and aldo got split)
cats shouldnt donate games, you can go to the bargain bin and pick up games for like two bucks. IF you want to donate, we take them, but you shouldnt have to buy, nor recieve extra points for them
the shirts was an idea we had, but never did (ive been hounding for letterman jackets) sorta with the sgda cards linked to jobquest
thats why verns team has usually just made their own shirts, it doesnt take from sgdas budget, and it gives us advertising
you want shirts, make em
in all honesty, i dont see them shutting sgda down, because if they did, that is their biggest, most successful club down the poop chute, they say it at every meeting that clubs try to emulate out success
most clubs meet bi monthly and dont receive NEAR the attendance we do
however, i do think that some rules have been broken regarding us, and we need to remember that we are in school, and using their tools and labs, and as such we need to respect them

[TeacupBandit]

I think a big thing that me and kraemer are trying to get across as well is the fact that SGDA is getting bigger. Which is AWESOME. The fact that we can all barely fit in a room is really cool. Having five people on a team would be perfect for our current point system, but this time we had 6 in most teams, I'm pretty sure, and it got to a point where some people were doing Game Jam while others were kinda screwing around. I know I know, it all about having fun and learning. Some people were getting upset because they were working and others werent. I just think if there were extra points that it would also help direct the teams in more directions. It would give more to do. I am not saying have a ton of environments, i am suggesting more props or something along those lines, easy stuff... Plus I think having more points available can help widen that gap we see between placing so often... or it can widen it more...

cats shouldnt donate games, you can go to the bargain bin and pick up games for like two bucks. IF you want to donate, we take them, but you shouldnt have to buy, nor recieve extra points for them

I agree with this, I dont think you should get points for this. How many people have said that Game Jam is not about prizes or competition. Then why are there prizes? Why waste the budget on games that arent that good and are cheap for a reason? Maybe I'll understand when I am an officer for a bit longer.

the verbs and stuff were initiated to set you on a spring board of sorts
you could take them and run, or leave them behind you and go with another totally different thing

Then seriously, why do we still have them? If this is the case then scrap em. If we are just gonna say "oh here are these verbs and a twist that we want you to incorporate in your game, but you dont have to and you can really do whatever the hell you want with em..." then the verbs need to not be required in the design doc and shouldnt even be a concern on the thursday meetings before hand. I'm sorry if this seems like badgering, but I just think that having those certain things in the jam is a good idea and we should really stick to our guns on that.

[Butterguts]

i EXPECT penises(peni?) from vern and matey

Best part, me and matey drew 0 peni...


As far as the verbs. My first jam was IV, and in that one, we all had to mimic storybook ideas. You would come in on Friday morning and sit down with Swink and the prototypers, after you drew a story at random, and they would tell you pretty much the game you we're going to make. The art teams really didn't have a say. Luckily we had Orion that quarter as our prototyper and he was down with working extra to make the idea we wanted not the idea we we're given.

Then next few jams we just made whatever we wanted. Problem there was direction, teams would bicker and argue for different ideas because no one was in charge and there was no direction to anything. So we added verbs, not as a concrete line, cause the story book jam was horribly restrained, but as jump starters to get everyones brains centered around a certain mechanic or idea. The Art Twist was so you didn't start concepting and modeling prior to Jam. Not just the night before, but even a week before or using old models to win. Now, i know, it's not a competition and it's about community. But go read the postmortem of GJ V, and you'll see a very unhappy group of people. We learn from our mistakes. Everything that was here now was to fix old problems. Game Jam is nice now. I like it. But believe in when saying, it's come a long way.

[duoxan]

dude
read
THEY ARE A SPRING BOARD
a jump start
they are there for those of us who arent good at making a game, we arent all game designers, and few of us actually sit down and analyze a game and find its core mechanics and why we like them
the prizes are there as a motivator, and a fun little side bonus
how many teams had six?
it is cool that we are getting bigger, and we prolly do need to tweak some things to benefit these larger teams
i dont even agree with the art twist, but how i see it is its there to encourage people to work out of their comfort zones, you know, like if someone only models miltary type models, its to get them to try something new, like richard scary models
the problem with getting more staff in on it is simple
its the weekend, they are busy people, and if i was missal or someone else
i wouldnt drive across town on my day off to critique stuff on my free time
i dont expect swink to be there, its cool when he is, but he has stuff to do. to get an industry professional to come in is absurd, i wouldnt even try it
vern is right
we have come a looooong way since four

[Cor]

hey so i totally missed this GJ.

although i did hear about a penis theme? or somthing like that?

then,during final presentations some kid seen a  bunch of peni?

what? sounds magical

[Screw-on Hed]

sorry if im late to the party. i read most of what was said and here's my two cents:

-points for the main content and art are great. character, environment, and props are the most important part of the art team.
-prototypers are starting to make more of an appearance so prototypes need to be addressed better. prototypes need to be seen as part of a more finished project rather than the burden most see it as.
-the unreal promise is a great addition. it still however needs to be tweaked. jon said that when he was going around hearing everyones game design, some teams just came with a half assed idea and just said they "would just put it in unreal." not cool. unreal should be encouraged for beauty shots and presentations, but overall the art needs to further a real game design.
-side quest points are ok. but from what i hear people say, they bank heavily on them. shouldnt be the case. cant think of a good way to adjust that. :/
-checkpoint meetings at 5 should be about CRITIQUES. i didnt hear a one. especially when some unwraps could clearly be improved upon. RC did say a couple things about a couple of the teams on friday, but noone really listened or gave any more time for critiques. this would totally be beneficial to all the all-noob teams who are just peeing in the wind.


i might have some more to say later.

[Dange]

Heya!  This is Daniel, the guy from DeVry. 

First off: sweet!  I enjoyed the jam.  Food, fun, new friends, experience.  I'm definately gonna try coming back again, but I can't make any promises about being able to bring anyone else with me.

Secondly: virtools.  Virtools felt very limited at first.  I won't go into detail, but I had to think in more basic ways to get it to work.  Also, something about it made concentrating very difficult.  I probly spent a total of six hours just staring at my screen with my mind wandering.  But now that I'm less of a virtools newb, I feel I could make something really cool.

Next: Unreal.  I haven't worked with unreal scripts yet, but it might be a good option for us prototypers.  I bet someone's already kicked the idea around before, but I felt like typing it.

Last: Vandals.  Overall, I loved the idea!  There were some really good ones,  but after that fourth penis...

[Aoloebio]

Welcome to forums Daniel, I am glad that you had a good time at game jam and I hope I was a good enough mentor for virtools. I am unsure as of yet if I will be available for the next jam but I hope to be present to assist with virtools yet again. Don't feel too pressured to bring in people, because even if your the only one that comes back, we at least have set things in motion between our schools and that was the whole idea. So again thank you for spending a weekend with us.

As far as unreal goes, we as vgp students never officially learn it, just like virtools. I personally feel that its much more complex to get things off the ground with the small amount of unreal scripting I have done so far. But if you truely want to learn it I could possibly do an UnrealScript workshop by the end of this quarter to at least get things moving...

And lastly as far as penis jokes go, I feel I gave you fair warning about vandal points

[Kraemology]

Welcome to the boards Dan. It was great to see you come out to game jam.

[SStrickland]

Thank you Daniel for participating. Hope to have you back.